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« Mayor Ray Nagin takes the dive | Main | NSA historical note »

Proposal to dissolve BATF

Posted by David Hardy · 10 July 2014 12:32 PM

The proposal is being floated by Rep. Jim Sensenbrenner (R-Wis.). I assume it's focusing upon the enforcement operations, presently in Justice. There may be a good case for transferring the industry operations to Commerce, as I heard proposed in the 1980s. BATF started out in Treasury only because the NFA was passed as nominally a tax measure. Commerce has historically dealt with regulated industries, and isn't famous for causing them problems.

With a proposal like this, I'd expect most of the agents to be transferred, but much of the management would be laid off, as redundant with that in the receiving agency -- which might benefit everyone.

Not that transferring functions to the FBI would eliminate all problems, but it might reduce them.

· BATFE

10 Comments | Leave a comment

Flight-ER-Doc | July 10, 2014 1:22 PM | Reply

Good idea, except the part about retaining agents. The thugs with badges at BATFE will not be able to behave like civilized people and the terrorism will continue.

If a legitimate concern arises, let the FBI or the US Marshals Service deal with it, without the terrorists stomping puppies - although Randy Weaver and his surviving family can attest that neither the FBI or USMS is professional.

fwb | July 10, 2014 2:30 PM | Reply

I'm still having trouble locating the grant of power which allows the federal government to have police powers as part of commerce or taxation. Explicit grants are there, with the N&P clause, for police powers over counterfeiting and piracies on the high seas, and a couple of other areas. But for the life of me, I cannot find any grant of police power in other areas. It is strange that the Framers would bother to explicitly grant certain police power and leave all the other more important police powers to implied existence. Or maybe it's that the N&P does NOT carry with it any grants of new powers. Many folks try to claim that anything that supports a granted power is legitimate but then if that were true, why did the Framers see the need to explicitly grant a police power over counterfeiting after they had given the feds the power to make the coins? And why after granted the power to make the coins, did the Framers think it necessary to grant the SEPARATE power to set the value of the coins. According to those who think the N&P is expansive, there is absolutely no need because the N&P automatically makes many implied powers legit.

Jeff Dege | July 10, 2014 2:33 PM | Reply

The biggest problem with closing down BATFE is that none of the agencies want their agents.

They're not called "F-Troop" for nothing.

Mark-1 | July 10, 2014 4:12 PM | Reply

Minute you have an org setup to collect money, they begin to straddle that legal fence.

That's BATFE. They collect money.

Flight-ER-Doc replied to comment from Jeff Dege | July 10, 2014 5:51 PM | Reply

Then fire their sorry rears....

wrangler5 | July 10, 2014 9:00 PM | Reply

Except for the air traffic controllers that Reagan fired, has any large group of gubmint employees ever lost gubmint employment? They may be moved around, but I thought one of the inviolable rules inside the Beltway was that nobody ever left the gubmint payroll. (I've read somewhere that NFA was passed at least in part to give former alcohol enforcement agents something to enforce once Prohibition ended. IOW, so that they would remain on the public payroll.)

Don't get me wrong, I think about half of the federal payroll should be permantly eliminated, for the long term good of the country. But my impression is that it's politically impossible, regardless of who appears to control the reins of power in DC.

Chuck | July 10, 2014 9:49 PM | Reply

It currently takes ATF 9 months to approve a Form 1. So if you want to cut your 16 inch barrel down to 14.5 inches you pay a 200 dollar tax and wait 9 months. Then you must get approval to transport your new rifle across state lines even though the Form 1 was approved by the FEDERAL government.

Yep, good law...we need more of them.

rspock | July 12, 2014 8:03 AM | Reply

Reality reduces the idea to a tale full of sound and fury signifying nothing. Notice I left out the idiot part - possibly a questionable decision. The ONLY circumstance where that becomes possible is if Conservatives take both branches of government and places like NY and CA with their statist RINOS somehow disappear. (And then there's McCain.)

Deep Lurker | July 12, 2014 10:58 AM | Reply

How about this: With the growing size of the "Mayors Against Guns And Convicted Of Felonies" organization (see the post about Ray Nagin), we'll need to build a new prison to hold them all. So transfer the BATFE agents to new duties as prison guards for that prison.

And as part of the regulations governing the agents' new duties, require them to live in housing built within the prison complex.

MJA | July 14, 2014 9:18 PM | Reply

I have mixed feelings about this... on the one hand, one less federal bureaucracy is a few thousand fewer bureaucrats, and that's a good thing. On the other hand, I'm involved in a civil rights restoration effort, and I think BATF if the agency I have to deal with.

In 1973, I was arrested during a raid in a bar in Westfield, New Jersey... someone threw a pistol under the table where I was sitting, and we all were charged with simple Possession of a Weapon - Gun. I did 63 days in Union County Jail and they released me with a suspended sentence.

I haven't had an arrest in over 40 years... a traffic ticket or two, but that's it.

Now, a 20+year resident of Arizona, I'm being denied the right to own a firearm because (I assume) of this ding on my rap sheet... there were other prior offenses, but none as serious as POW, and no sex or violence. If they pink-slip the entire BATF, who do I badger with my case?

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