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"Gun Walker" keeps growing
Now the former ATF attache to Mexico, in charge of agency operations there, is talking to CBS News. He was told that the operation had been approved by the acting ATF director and by higher officials at Justice Department, and that Assistant Attorney General and head of the Criminal Division Larry Breuer knew about it. And apparent it did result in a lot of traces that would illustrate how US guns were ending up in Mexico:
"Gil first found out something was amiss in early 2010 when serial numbers from a flood of guns used in cartel crimes were all tracing back to the same case in Phoenix: "Fast and Furious." But when Gil's analyst checked ATF's computer files to find out more, he hit a brick wall.
"Not only did he not have access, I as the attache, the head agent in Mexico for ATF operations, did not have access," says Gil. He was locked out.
That was a red flag because Gil says as the senior ATF official in Mexico, it was his job to approve any ATF operation involving Mexico; and he didn't approve this one."
UPDATE: in the comments, Dedicated_Dad hits it on the head:
"Please consider:
(1) Have dealers - working as "confidential informants" - sell guns to straw buyers and report details to ATF.
(2) Allow guns to be smuggled into Mexico, without the knowledge of anyone IN Mexico - not the Mexi.gov, not US ATF agents or their boss the "attache", not ANYONE.
(3) ????
(4) Make some big case!
Please tell me what must -- or even theoretically COULD -- happen at step "3" for this to work!"
Exactly. How could anyone imagine (3). If the Mexican authorities don't know, they can't investigate (might not anyway, but if they don't know they surely cannot. ATF can hardly mount an on the ground investigation there, esp. without notifying local law enforcement. All that could ever be ascertained was that guns shipped to cartels wind up at crime scenes, and everyone already knew that. That'd get you nowhere toward making a big case.
Another thought: I'd initially figured knowledge of this operation wouldn't have gone to high levels. The managers who were running it probably would have figured that if they sent the info up the chain of command, somebody might stop it, or have lots of awkward questions, or delay until he got a lot of consensus (as in CYA -- spread the blame around if things go bad). But now it appears knowledge did go high. The guy who is telling the attache that it's gone to the agency head and higher is implicitly telling him: "if you keep arguing about this, you'll eventually have to explain to someone a LOT more powerful than you, and someone's gonna phrase it as "the operation you allowed -- there's some attache guy who thinks only a moron could have allowed it." And now it appears knowledge got as high as an Assistant Attorney General, an appointee. If it got that high, odds are good it would have gotten to the AG. And if it got to him, odds are decent that it got to the White House. I note the official denials are that anyone high up "approved" it. You can of course know of something, decide to let it run its course, and still deny having "approved" it. CYA and all that. "They told me about it, I just assumed they knew what they were doing."
· BATFE
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The ATF had (and has) nothing to lose. By secretly allowing weapons from the U.S. to cross into Mexico, they can illustrate the need for more funding to prevent weapons from the U.S. crossing into Mexico. This game has been played before.
Worst case - should anyone discover their little plan - the ATF and possibly higher-ups in the administration would be embarrassed. That's it. People may get shuffled around, but no one's going to prison.
Consider Waco. Who in government went down over that atrocity? No one. That was worse than Gunwalker.
You've nailed it. This was a false-flag op, designed to provide the excuse to abrogate our God-given/Constitutionally-protected rights, using the uncountable corpses of Mexican people for said excuse.
A simple examination of the facts we know vs. the claims (LIES!) of those responsible can lead to no other conclusion!
Please consider:
(1) Have dealers - working as "confidential informants" - sell guns to straw buyers and report details to ATF.
(2) Allow guns to be smuggled into Mexico, without the knowledge of anyone IN Mexico - not the Mexi.gov, not US ATF agents or their boss the "attache", not ANYONE.
(3) ????
(4) Make some big case!
Please tell me what must -- or even theoretically COULD -- happen at step "3" for this to work!
Occam's razor demands that the only possible conclusion be treason and tyranny!
Further, there's simply **NO WAY** that this happened without collusion at the HIGHEST levels of DOJ (Holder) State (Clinton) and the WH (Dear Reader, Chairman MaoBama). No.Frigging.WAY!
No way!
DD
Years ago if a prison inmate made a break and got away he was free for X amount of time. Now if an inmate tries and or gets caught its a new charge and more prison time.
Being said, to set up a crime by committing treason to attack the Constitutional rights of the American citizens, is like a prison break in years past.
My personal hunch, a lot of noise is to come and thats about it. But it will be another showing of how the citizens have lost their country. All and thats every single mandate by government is enforced at the barrel of a gun. A country for free men?
"Waco" Jim Cavanaugh is doing a lot of talking. Is he representing the government of the United States or is he just trying to cover for his good ol' boy "remember when" friends in ATF?
After his showing at the Waco human Bar-B-Q of the Davidians and his cover-up there, I wouldn't cash one of his personal checks.
When the final tally is in from the ATF Gunwalker deaths Waco will pale in comparison. The fatalities from the hundreds of guns from the 2 Texas, 1 New Mexico,and 1 Arizona operations so far include two federal agents and untold numbers of Mexican Subjects, not to mention those folks who have survived their wounds.
The decision to engage in illegal smuggling operations across three states could not have originated with the "boots on the ground" agents. Look to Washington DC.
[W3]
(3) ????
(4) Make some big case!
How paranoid would you like to be? Make some big case...against the dealers illegally sending "millions of fully automatic assault rifles into Mexico. What? What are you talking about - of course we certainly wouldn't authorize something like this! If we would have, you can be sure the Mexican gov't would be informed. Paranoid rubes. Now I'm sure everyone sees the clear need to restrict the these '2nd amendment' rights to muzzle loaders, but like they had back then. But they'll need to be sub .50 caliber - those can take out helicopters, 474s, satellites, and rutabaga class alien space craft!"
So I exaggerate. Slightly. Do we know what date this operation was allegedly approved? Implementation began?
Ah, after reading the other comments, I see others drew similar conclusions.
Remember that ATF budget hearings were going on at the time of Waco.
I think a lot of these guys have watched too many James Bond movies. "We must get the evil mastermind behind all this! Once we do that, the world will be safe!" Not that James Bond is the only one; Hollywood loves that sort of plot. It's so much more exciting than the real-world business of tracking down misbehaving low-lifes.
Man I hate conspiracy theories, and this one almost seems too amateurish- which is what makes it believable given the current administration. Consider the oil drilling issue. Obama runs on a No-Drilling position – Obama wins the election but the position is somewhat unpopular – Obama suddenly (strangely) supports drilling – oil platform in the Gulf of Mexico (strangely) explodes and causes massive pollution – Obama decides it’s too dangerous for America to drill – Obama goes to Brazil to support their drilling of oil.
Nevertheless, how would they have expected to keep this secret given the number of potential whistleblowers in the lower ranks?
Man I hate conspiracy theories, and this one almost seems too amateurish- which is what makes it believable given the current administration.
Those were my thoughts exactly. Usually, conspiracy theorists assume superhuman competence; for instance, the 9/11 Liars assume that for several weeks prior, the government had been placing explosive devices throughout two of the busiest buildings in the nation without anyone noticing.
Here, in contrast, you have actions that seem more like a real conspiracy. The administration was picking up a cause that was unlikely to gain traction, at a time when much more important issues were under consideration. They bring up an odd side issue of Mexican gun traces--I suspect in order to mobilize the Hispanic vote for gun control--and miraculously find some misconstrued statistics to "prove" that America's gun dealers are murdering poor little Mexicans in Mexico. The stats in question prove nothing of the sort, and yet the administration keeps pushing it, and then abruptly backs off.
It sounds to me as if someone in Obama's circle had the brilliant plan of setting up gun dealers for a fall, and as if they were not competent enough to set them up for one. When their initial stats were proven wrong, they kept repeating the same discredited lines. I suspect this was because they were involved in, yes, a conspiracy, and like most conspirators they were unable to leave their original script.
How could they have expected to keep this secret?
Through intimidation tactics, the same way they have so much other stuff in the past.
"You want your paycheck and your pension? STFU, or you'll end up passing out sandwiches at the Pima-county jail".
They were also - no doubt - counting on their media lap-dogs and other fellow-travelers (Helmke, et-al) to provide noisome cover. "Blame the NRA!!" - which is also happening!
Read up on what they've done to previous "whistleblowers", and read the CUATF site to see how many are STILL too scared to come forward!
Then consider the WaPo "investigations", and the ATF press-releases badmouthing the dealers involved, before "gunwalker" became public knowledge. They denigrated the very dealers who were working as C.I.s for them in this whole thing - seeking to run them out of business!
It's all there in black-and-white.
I'm not big on "conspiracy theories" either, but when it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, looks and smells like a duck, the odds are good it's a bloody DUCK!
I'm still waiting for anyone to explain to me how #3 works - in light of everything we know now - to "make some big case". It's just not possible!
The ONLY thing that makes ANY sense is that it's a "false flag" op intended to "prove" their previous claims and "justify" further 2A restrictions.
I'd LOVE to be wrong, but I'm not.
I do hereby declare the ATFs new nickname to be "The Underpants Gnomes" or "TUG"!
"#3 works - in light of everything we know now - to "make some big case""
I thought it pretty obvious. The case would be against the gun dealers (no one else makes any sense). How would that be achieved due to ATF complicity? Simple: have the ATF lie. Shutting up agents in the past apparently hasn't been too problematic. There's your case, which supports to statistic, to leverage the will, to change the law, to restrict the rights, and I don't know why she swallowed the fly, perhaps she'll die.
The more I learn about this the more concerned I become. I'm still struggling with the why senior ATF & DOJ staff would think this entire scheme was a good idea. It's hard to believe that US officials would let guns "walk" without the stakes being very high.
What was the "end game" of this operation? Did ATF & DOJ want more "proof" that the firearms used my the Mexican cartels came from the US? Was it ATF's hope to gain funding & publicity from this operation? Or was this something else entirely?
I hate to sound paranoid but could this honestly be how the current administration planned to drum up support for increased firearm regulations? Or was this to be the excuse for an "executive order" reinstating the prior assault weapons ban without Congressional approval?
I honestly never thought I'd see the day when a federal law enforcement agency would act with such willful disregard for the laws they were sworn to uphold. I pray that the entire truth comes to light but I doubt it will be possible until early 2013.