Anyone have a need for a historian or programmer?

Welcome to the club.

Still, there are worse fields to be out of work in than programming.

I like him as a progun guy, but his widely publicized rampant homophobia will limit his choices.

With all due respect, I don't think anyone cares about his opinions on homosexuality. The big issues are more likely to be:
-lack of jobs
-what languages he programs in
-how long it's been since he programmed

http://www.shotgunnews.com/cramer/

"How to lose friends"

God bless the first amendment that lets people write in favor of the second and then against, before the ink is even dry. I say he lost a few friends with his latest column.

If somebody wants to carry a gun in the OPEN, who the hell cares? If they have a legal right to be some place, even if it’s a Presidental event, who the hell cares if they are carrying a gun in the open? (I guess Cramer does).

Next time, EVERYBODY should carry their gun. Or better yet, if you don't like it, go home. It's called Freedom, but alas, not everybody understands that.

I'd say several here are ungrateful pricks. Cramer has done more for gun rights in the US than you have (no, not you Dave) and all you assholes can do is pick the flyshit out of the pepper. You weren't quoted in Heller were you! Cramer was. Sit down and shut the f--k up. I am sick and tired of wannabes who only know how to criticize those who truly made a difference.

Shawn - how long have YOU been active in gun rights? David, Clayton, and I were all active in online gun rights discussions over a decade ago, including hashing out some of the legal arguments now being used to advance our gun rights nationwide. He's not saying open carry should be illegal, he's saying that it can be a public relations problem.

Pepper and Fly Shit.

Does doing a good deed buy one the right to commit a bad one? Undermine, insult, and even lie about others?

I know of no person who retrieved a right stolen by being nice. The function of a society that trips rights away, includes in it's propaganda that the right is offensive, inhuman, etc... By the nature of this, the fight to retrieve any freedom requires offending people.

"Being offended" is the propagandist's mode of preventing thought and it is embedded in every well-engineered oppression. A person convinced of how terrible Dark Skin is, does not think about the absurdity of it. All forms of anti-human-rights agenda have this at their root. A deflection from legitimate thought to the 'conventional wisdom' of the faction of the moment. Label it 'dirty,' and nobody gives it real thought; they just dream up arguments to support their contempt without realizing that their feelings of contempt are the very problem.. Even Cramer, apparently...

Being quoted in Miller doesn't give the man any authority to kick someone else in the balls. If anything, this demonstration of flawed thinking discredits him. You'd think someone so entrenched would know better.

Well Dustin I truly doubt you walk the talk. You carry every day, everywhere? I thought not. What the man was talking about was discretion, not caving in. I take it you enjoy cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Gosh, Cramer has the guts to say what he believes, when it is not popular, or could even hurt him. That says a lot about his good character. The fact that he has done so much for gun rights should be cause for readers to carefully consider what he has said.

Jeff

> I know of no person who retrieved a right stolen by being nice.

Since you don't know anyone who has retrieved a right by any means, that's not saying much. (No, reading about the civil rights movement doesn't count.) Yes, the "we're here and we're queer" folks have fun and see themselves as righteous, but they've set back their cause in middle America.

Since you're going to disagree, cite chapter and verse. And no, drinking with your friends who were already pro-gun doesn't count.

Pissing off and scaring people who are basically on your side is childish and counter-productive. CA's CCW laws happened when the Black Panthers decided to do an armed-sit-in with the CA legislature, to protest gun laws.

If you want to get to a world where open carry is accepted, act like the kind of person who other people would like to see carrying openly. That's means acting reasonably, and today, in most places, that means keep it to yourself.

Gun banners win because they can take small steps towards their goal, convincing folks as they go. (They "boil the frog".) Many pro-gun folks think that anything other than a complete and total win that is forever is not worth anything. Since there is no such thing as a complete and total win that is forever....

It all comes down to do you want to win by taking what you can get every chance you get or do you want to act out and lose? (Hint: "first we commit suicide and then make a comeback" isn't actually a winning strategy.)

It's pretty shameful to see people come in here and bash Cramer because he's come forth with an opinion they disagree with. Even if he were wrong about this particular issue, the dude has still contributed more to the gun rights movement than all but a few dozen people in this country.

The saddest part is that Cramer is actually right about open carry and how it often isn't a constructive way of helping the gun rights movement. It's loudmouth idiots like Dustin and Shawn that frighten otherwise indifferent citizens into becoming anti-gun voters.

Taking an uncompromising hard line seems like courage, but it's really just simple mindedness that leaves you perpetually on the margins of political progress. It's the easy way out, because it saves you the trouble of persuading the people in the middle. Real courage is in accommodating positions you disagree with to nudge people in our direction. With compromise comes risk of failure but it's also the only real avenue to success with the general population.

Well said!

Typical.

Hate takes precedence over reason and dialogue...

You make excuses to preserve treating antoehr person like a lesser life form, and refuse to hear a word spoken.

Drink more Kool Aide.

I think that there are two issues that have become interwoven:

1. It seems clear that no one can dispute Clayton Cramer's contribution to protecting the second amendment. I also have no problems with his position on open carry (although I do not completely agree with him).

2. Some of us, myself included, are more than just a little upset by his remarks about gays.

Lot's more people agree with Cramer's "remarks about gays" than are upset with them. Like it or don't.

(No, reading about the civil rights movement doesn't count.) Yes, the "we're here and we're queer" folks have fun and see themselves as righteous, but they've set back their cause in middle America.

Thanks for defending me Andy. And I should point out that Andy is one of those people who doesn't agree with me about homosexuality, but at least recognizes that there are ways to win, and ways to lose. Offending others seldom works. And it doesn't matter whether you are exposing your weapon or your firearm.

The good news is that I seem to have two classes to teach next term at my current employer. (State & Local Government worked out so well that I will be teaching Introduction to the Personal Computers and an introductory microcontroller programming class next term.) I also have an adjunct history position interview at another college tomorrow.