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Same old-Same old in New Orleans
Via Bob Dowlut:
The NY Times reports:
"NEW ORLEANS, Sept. 8 - Waters were receding across this flood-beaten city today as police officers began confiscating weapons, including legally registered weapons, from civilians in preparation for a mass forced evacuation of the residents still living here.
No civilians in New Orleans will be allowed to carry pistols, shotguns, or other firearms of any kind, said P. Edwin Compass, the superintendent of police. "Only law enforcement are allowed to have weapons," he said.
But that order apparently does not apply to the hundreds of security guards whom businesses and some wealthy individuals have hired to protect their property. The guards, who are civilians working for private security firms like Blackwater, are openly carrying M-16's and other assault rifles. Mr. Compass said he was aware of the private guards but that the police had no plans to make them give up their weapons."
So--
1. The response to chaos is to disarm the legit gun owners who want to protect themselves;
2. But of course the hired guns for the wealthy can pack full-auto guns anytime -- the wealthy and their guardians are different;
3. Not that anyone would worry about the Louisiana Bill of Rights: "The right of each citizen to keep and bear arms shall not be abridged, but this provision shall not prevent the passage of laws to prohibit the carrying of weapons concealed on the person." Art. I, ยง 11. The right takes on added meaning where people have been subjected to looting, rape, and anarchy, which the local government did little to stop (and in fact some police were photographed taking part in the looting).
4 Or, even if there were no constitutional provision, where a local Superintendant of Police can find the power to disarm by fiat, in the absense of any statute allowing it.
[UPDATE: It's been pointed out that Louisiana law (14 La. Rev. Statutes 329.6) allows a Superintendant, when the governor has declared an emergency, to issue orders "Regulating and controlling the possession, storage, display, sale, transport and use of firearms, other dangerous weapons and ammunition..." So he does have the statutory authority. Whether the statute is unconstitutional as applied remains as an issue.]
[FURTHER UPDATE: Dave Kopel presents some strong arguments that the order does violate statute: such an order has to be published in the newspaper and filed with several offices, none of which has apparently been done, and the use of "prohibiting" in other sections of the law and "regulating and controlling" here suggests that something less than total prohibition is authorized.
Orin Kerr differs with Dave, essentially arguing (1) while the statute says the order must be published and filed, it does not say that this is a precondition to its being effective and (2) the statutory power to "control" carrying of firearms is broad enough to cover the order, which doesn't bar ownership of guns but only their carrying.]
8 Comments
I think they are in poverty already. Disarming everyone is pretty facist. I'm glad the general in charge down there declined to participate in the forced evacs and I hope they decline to participate in this too.
C.A.G.
I sure hope to see some "cease and desist" court orders coming out before we have another Waco.
Haven't seen or heard anything from the NRA about this, but at least GOA knows about it. This should be an interesting twist in an already tragic situation. Can't believe New Orleans P.D. leadership would be this stupid--they have to have gone off the deep end.
http://www.gunowners.org/a090905.htm
Gun Confiscations in New Orleans
GOA has received reports that the confiscation of legally-owned firearms has commenced in New Orleans. In addition to denouncing this in the press, GOA will also be looking to draft legislation at both the state and federal level to preclude authorities from imposing ANY firearms restrictions during emergency response activities. This is expected to be a lengthy and arduous process...
I think that the Gov't confiscating lawfully-kept firearms from citizens during a time of civil disorder and/or civil insurrection constitutes the tort of Intentional Infliction of Emotional Distress.
In addition to the aforementioned questions about the constitutionality of the confiscation order as applied, perhaps someone could proceed post-haste to the nearest operational US Courthouse and file for an injunction to get the NOLAPD to cease and desist?
Perhaps that might be yourself, Counselor?
It has become *this bad* on some of the boards. I don't know anything other than what was posted here about the validity of the sender or of their information.
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=388209&page=10
"The gun seizures and the forced evacuations in Louisiana MUST STOP! Both are not only unconstitutional, but a demeaning and illegal strong-arming of law abiding citizens by the government. You cannot force a citizen to leave their property unless you have an arrest warrant or they themselves are creating a public heath emergency....a simple fear of the citizen getting sick is not enough to make them leave their property! As a Louisiana attroney, a current Louisiana assistant district attorney, and ex-policeman in Louisiana with 8 years of duty, this entire seizure of free people and/or their firearms is making me sick and ashamed that our country's constitutional safegards are so easily disregarded!!! No way would I take arms from law abiding citizens in their own homes if ordered to do so, and no way would I allow my arms to be taken from my home in time of crisis when I need them to protect my family. While you cannot use deadly force in Louisiana to simply protect property (otherthan when someone enters your home or vehicle, when you're present therein, to commit a theft or with intent to commit a felony...you may shoot them), you CAN use deadly force to resist an UNLAWFUL ARREST! Rule number one for Louisiana law enforcement...if you get your ass shot off making an illegal arrest, tough-shit...IT'S A JUSTIFIED HOMICIDE UNDER LOUISIANA LAW! I would strongly urge all officers participating in this crisis not to blindly follow orders from officials who do not have a clue, but to maintain the Constitution and laws of Louisiana and the United States. Remind yourself of your oath before being lead blind ignorant fools!!! Also, if there is another attorney who personally knows someone these atrocities are happening to, I plead with you to file on their behalf both an injunction and a 1983 action ASAP! THE UNARMING AND FORCED REMOVAL OF CITIZENS IN THEIR HOMES HAS GOT TO STOP!!!"
Well, I hope that this issue is redressed properly in the courts. I am not a lawyer, but I feel like the police superintendant, and any others responsible for putting this policy in place, as well as any LEOs who are choosing to enforce this deep breech of the consitution, should be put in jail for some time for violating civil rights. And if the police disarm anyone, and they become victims of a crime, then the police should be held responsible for failing to protect them. In fact, anyone who was a victim of a crime inside the superdome, or any other government shelter where the refugees were searched for weapons at the door, has a big beef IMO. I doubt anything will be done though, the best we can hope for is that some court will rule that this cannot be done in the future, and give the effected citizens a couple of dollars. If any jackbooted thugs come to collect my guns, when I am on my property, I dont plan on peacably handing them over. I dont want it to go that far, I prefer targets that dont shoot back, and I am not a violent person; but you have to draw a line somewhere.
The real question is, who will draw the line? The New Orleans Police Department is known to be one of the most corrupt in the country. Louisana state government makes New Jersey look honest by comparison.
I would definitely like to see someone draw the "line" but I don't think that it's going to happen.
Outrageous. Dave when and how do we sue the bastards into poverty?